I guess you read the answer Why is there something rather than nothing? because a lot of what you say seems to be your point of view of things discussed there!
I'll comment your answer later tonight!
I'll comment your answer later tonight!
Yes, I did read it. :) It was very interesting. I got lost with all the really complicated mathematical terms and equations, though. :D
This Power was there, ever-lasting, drifting within, or perhaps sitting on, the Nothing.
I disagree that you can have nothingness and something else that would be external to it. Nothingness is nothing, you can't have something external to it. If there is something (let's call that "god" or "the Power" as you said) then there is only that, not that and nothingness! Do you get it?
As I said in the other thread, "nothing" is only a word to say "the absence of anything", it's not "something" in itself. It doesn't exist. Therefore you can't have something and nothing.
To resume, creating something from pure nothingness is impossible because:
1) There is nothing in nothingness. In fact nothingness doesn't even exist. So "something" can't emerge from nothingness itself. Nothing can happen in nothingness.
2) If there is a force, or anything else, external to this nothingness, then it was not pure nothingness you were talking about. You were talking about this force alone, period.
My personnal conclusion is that something has always existed.
My personnal conclusion is that something has always existed.
This is what I think too. In my mind, the question is: what made this "always existing somethin" move. Because if something would exist without movement, then still there would be no universe. Yet, this something was moving, hence created time and change in matter, thus emerged the universe as we know it today. But what made that initial movement? Even if something has always been, it doesn't mean that it had to move, unless the fundamental laws of existence say that existence is movement.
The Big Bang theory states that everything in the universe was a... thing... about the size of a period in a sentence before the Big Bang, and that it was ssupposedly infinitely dense and hot, and then one day it just expanded.
This is what I think too. In my mind, the question is: what made this "always existing somethin" move. Because if something would exist without movement, then still there would be no universe. Yet, this something was moving, hence created time and change in matter, thus emerged the universe as we know it today. But what made that initial movement? Even if something has always been, it doesn't mean that it had to move, unless the fundamental laws of existence say that existence is movement.
Existence isn't movement, existence is time.
Time is not a product of existence, existence is a product of time.
Time is the bridge between nothingness and somethingness.
(interesting - my computer just told me there's no such word as 'somethingness' but yet the word 'nothingness' is fine)
If time were to stand still that is nothingness.
It doesn't matter that the the whole of the universe sits there in suspended animation, it is still nothingness in the absence of time.
Nothingness can only exist where time has completely stopped.
I would venture to say that nowhere in the universe has time stopped completely, except perhaps the moment just prior to the big bang where it all started up again.
Inside a black hole perhaps time has slowed to a point that one second might take a million earth years to pass, however that is still something.
At the moment of true nothingness, something is immediately created and nothingness ceases to exist again.
So in essence, something has always existed except where there was nothing thereby creating something.
Confused?? I hope so! :)
The Big Bang theory states that everything in the universe was a... thing... about the size of a period in a sentence before the Big Bang, and that it was ssupposedly infinitely dense and hot, and then one day it just expanded.
"and then one day it just expanded" :) just like that, right? :)
Movement had to start before the big bang, since high pressure (which caused the explosion) is because of high speed movements of particles inside matter.
Anyway, how did matter get into that tiny, infintely dense point if the nature of the universe is expansion?
I've got an idea.
What if every subatomic particle is a universe itself? As this universe expands, eventually all the subatomic particles will burst. What if this burst of the particles will burst the space-time too, and the energy of the particle will "fall into" another space-time continuum, where the energy of the whole universe will be the energy of our subatomic particle. Thus after a universe ends, billions of much smaller universes appear, where this particle holds the energy of the entire universe. Thus, the matter of the particle will start to shrink according to it's own very large gravity (since there won't be any other gravitation source). Eventually, this shrinking will lead to so high density that the particle will explode, and it will give birth to a whole new universe which will be essentially the same as our, just very much smaller :)
Yep. It all happened just like that :)
I just read that in a science book from eighth grade, so it didn't go into specifics on the Big Bang.
I have thought of the subatomic idea, but not a lot about it.
Iam, if time stood still it wouldn't mean nothingness, it would mean the absence of molecular motion. Or something. Ask Path.
I just read that in a science book from eighth grade, so it didn't go into specifics on the Big Bang.
I have thought of the subatomic idea, but not a lot about it.
Iam, if time stood still it wouldn't mean nothingness, it would mean the absence of molecular motion. Or something. Ask Path.
Iam, if time stood still it wouldn't mean nothingness, it would mean the absence of molecular motion. Or something. Ask Path.
Well, actually, it might. Because if everything stood still, there would be zero movement... It really would be nothing, in a sense. I don't know how to explain it, but we have already concluded that if there was nothing, then that could never change because there would be nothing to change it. So, if everything stood still - and I mean every particle, every piece of energy or mass, even space - then nothing would ever happen, and it would really be just the same as nothingness. If there was no time, no movement, nothing would ever occur. Do you sorta kinda maybe get what I'm saying? :P
The Big Bang theory states that everything in the universe was a... thing... about the size of a period in a sentence before the Big Bang, and that it was ssupposedly infinitely dense and hot, and then one day it just expanded.
True, but I have always wondered what was outside that "period." Because if we can conclude it took up about that much space, then we must also conclude that there was space outside of it. And it couldn't be nothingness, because we decided that nothingness cannot exist with something else, there is only nothingness or something, not both.
Finally, I think that in order for the universe to be everlasting, it would have to travel in a circle, because a circle has no beginning. Which makes sense, when you think about it, because most things in existence tend to form into spheres when given the chance. A drop of water, a planet, the circle of life... why not "the circle of universe?" :)
Try it. Try to think of nothing. Not in the sense of clearing your mind, having no thoughts – think about existence if it was nothing... nothing existed. Your mind automatically shies away from such a concept, because suddenly, all the boundaries you have placed on your thoughts, you life – all the constants, things you are sure of, are no longer sure. There are no facts, no reason, no logic to justify such a thing as nothing.
Of course, in order to think of nothing, you must remove the word “nothing” from your mind, because it is a word, and therefore cannot describe the concept. I will not try to name the concept myself, because any name would remove the meaning. So just focus your mind on everything… gone.
I can only imagine, or try to imagine, the concept of nothingness for about half a second before I return to logic and rational thought. If you can concentrate on and believe in nothingness for more than two seconds, I’d say you’re probably doing it wrong. But maybe I’m just really bad at it. :P
I said I’d make this short. Ha!
Well, the point is, it is impossible to think of nothing because every limit we know is rendered useless. We cannot measure it in any way, ourselves being inside the equation itself, so our brains cannot process the existence of non-existence.
And, basically, that is my answer. Nothing is impossible. Immeasurable. Inconceivable. It’s too scary to comprehend. The question, “Why is there something rather than nothing?” is invalid, it has no answer that we can know because one of the terms used in the equation is undefined. There is something. That is all we can comprehend – the why, the reason it exists just so, is beyond our ability to understand, ourselves being a part of the term, “something.”
Sorry, guys. I really was going to try to make this short. Ah, well.
Now, we can assume that either 1) there was always something. There was never just nothing. Something is eternal and cannot be created or destroyed. Kind of like energy! :P Or, if you are willing to accept a concept that has some flaws, but in some ways, is still more believable than the first, 2) there was nothing. Nothing at all. But the equation became unbalanced… and created something.
Now, of course, this contradicts the very point accepted in the first option – that something can be created. I also know what you’re going to say – that there had to be something to unbalance the equation in the first place. You would be correct. However, as I pointed out, this theory is only for those who are willing to let go of a little logic and just believe.
In some ways, this is the concept of God. I do not myself believe in God – at least not the God as He is known on Earth, one who involves Himself in earthly affairs. This “God,” for lack of a better word, would be the value that pushed nothingness – imagine nothingness as teetering on a thin, impossibly thin, wire, where on one side is something, the wire is nothing, and the other side… who knows? Death? A negative something, that is losing values, rather than gaining them? Or perhaps we are the negative side… o_O But enough of this craziness. Back to the point.
*throws the word “short” out the window*
This God would not be a thinking being, watching over us and whatnot. It (because having no gender, this God could only be classified as such – really, our language is so limited) would be a Power vast and ever-lasting, that could exist in nothingness without becoming nothingness, but without making it something, either. Of course, you say that is impossible – if this Power was among nothingness, then the nothingness would have something – but let’s just say that is why It is so powerful… It can accomplish things beyond logic and reason.
This Power was there, ever-lasting, drifting within, or perhaps sitting on, the Nothing. (Hey, now we have given them names! :P Which I did say one shouldn’t do, but it is necessary for the purpose of this theory) Anyway, the Power – for some unknown, inexplicable reason, or perhaps no reason at all – decided, or maybe didn’t decide, but just happened to lean over. A small shift of power – not energy, of course, because energy did not exist. But perhaps a shift of thought. The Power just did something – and thus began a chain reaction, and the Nothing tilted, and slipped, and fell… into the Something.
I don’t know if I believe this theory or not – it is just an idea, a concept that I am turning around in my head, but that I decided to share with you. :)
So, to recap – I can’t answer the question, “Why is there something rather than nothing?” because 1) we are a part of the equation, 2) nothing cannot be defined or conceived, and 3) we do not know if there ever has been nothing in the past. However, I hope you enjoyed my ideas, theories, whatever, presented in my *very* long post. Feel free to comment, ask questions, make suggestions, etc. But please keep your responses civil. :)